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Quew

Land Claims

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The first ships to leave England to colonize the Americas was funded by the government.

A player wanting to expand there land area would start by hiring personnel to settle the new land.
Each unit of land would require a certain number of personnel to begin the process of land claiming for settlement.
The population used for this process be removed from the primary population pool once land claims have been started they would be added to a temporary population pool that would be used for tracking population density in the claimed and colonial areas.
When Claimed land reaches a certain population density it becomes Colonial land and when colonial population density reaches a higher level it gets added to the Core land and the population gets re-added back in to the normal population pool.
There would be two ways that the population in claimed land would grow.

The first would be the normal way populations grow in this game.
The second would be to hire more personnel and send them off to the new lands.
Ideally it would also be effected by none player influenced migration from the motherland/core territory when population density gets to high.

 

It seems odd to me that you buy land in this game when there does not appear to be anyone you are buying it from, so instead of buying land from mystery agents the limit on land claims would be based on 1 or both of these rules i came up with for keeping anyone from trying to lay claim to the entire map, not counting how foolish that would be with the interaction rules i thought up for dealing with claim clashes i will explain a little bit later.

Rule 1
No larger claim then x% of core land on a claim.
I imagined 10% in my mind for this one but it is flexible.
Rule 2
Land claims can only be done when population density in core lands above a certain amount.
my thoughts were something like 1000 per sq-km but again this idea is flexible.

If it was decided that both rules were to be applied then it would be that there would be a fair sum of land claims that can be done when a nation is first founded.
I would also point out that only 1 land claim should be allowed at a time once land claim goes to colonial a new land claim can be started.
As far as costs go this process would both lower income from population being send out of core(Taxed) land but also until the land becomes core the player would still be paying the the Personnel they sent to settle the land.


Any measure of land would be considered to be in 1 of 4 different conditions at all times these types are (Core)(Colonial)(Claimed)(Unoccupied).

Other unmentioned rules in regard to this 4 types of land.

(Core) No significant changes

(Colonial) Rules similar to core but population goes untaxed or lower then normal tax level.

(Claimed) Pre-war system(where we are now at the time of this posting) this land is open to competing claims that means that when you or someone else is trying to claim land someone else can choose to try and thwart or steal land by placing a claim over yours partly or in total rules for dealing with this are as follows.
In situations were total claim clashes are attempted (they or you happened to issue a claim for all or more of the land you are claiming) the player with 51% or more of the population when it reaches the intended population density gains it.
this of course means that if 3 or more players end up on the same area when attempting to claim clash at close to the same time that only the person that stayed with the claim efforts the longest would win because of the fact that until all but two drop out of such a race none can claim a 51% population majority in the claim clash zone.
Non-total claim clashes (Where they or you claim less then all of the claimed land of the other party) in this situation the person trying to claim the higher amount of land will be at a disadvantage as the larger amount of land will take longer to bring to the needed population density in order to make colonial.
in the situation were the person with the smaller claim gains the population level of colonial before the person with the larger claim does that person gets to take a chunk out of the intended claim, the only upside for the one losing claim land is that the remaining claim area would get to colonial status sooner.
Post war system (some point beyond the date of this post) when the war system is in place and working you would be able to send troops to escort your settlers as they work to claim the land so that random players can't just claim clash you without war, unless you forget to send the escort.

(Unoccupied) No significant changes.


Last notes on land claims and claim clashes.
Claimed land is intended to be open to less formal forms of war as you often see in history of uncertain territorial claims leading to minor skirmishes that can sometimes end up in wars.
Also claim clashes would have to be done intentionally because when selecting new land to claim the land would be displayed in two ways one as (Unoccupied) and the other as (Claimed) and you would pick how much of each you want to lay claim to with the total of one the other or both being no higher then the rules suggested above.

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The biggest problem with this suggestion is that it requires a finite amount of available land, which means eventually new players will be unable to join the game.

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dane0

 

What is not constructive if you want me to clarify something you need more then one word what you need is to be clear as to what it is you are confused about.

 

Fox

 

No just sprucing up the land gain part of the game.

As i said to the wooky above you one word is not good enough for a constructive reply.

 

Grillick

 

I did see that they had removed the total land count but i had thought it was just something they had not yet added back in if indeed they decided to make the total land unlimited as you suggest then only change needed is to remove the unoccupied land category.

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"What" is a completely valid response, looking at this proposal. Might as well make an entirely new game rather than overhaul the land system when we don't even have trade and war coded.

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Quew, I'm not seeing what this would add to the game, other than a layer of significant complexity. I'm not averse to complexity per se, but it needs to add something of value to the game as well. I don't see that in this proposal. 

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"What" is a completely valid response, looking at this proposal. Might as well make an entirely new game rather than overhaul the land system when we don't even have trade and war coded.

^This

Quew, I'm not seeing what this would add to the game, other than a layer of significant complexity. I'm not averse to complexity per se, but it needs to add something of value to the game as well. I don't see that in this proposal.

^And this.

My problem with this, it that it sounds very complicated and time consuming when there really isn't any demand for it.

I do like PT for it being in.depth and realistic, but we need to remember that it is a game and although I geek out on it, my life doesn't revolve around it.

Im all for new additions, but this is very complex and it doesn't really strike me as a fun addition. It just sounds unreasonably tedious. Almost like ruling two nations at once. If I wanted a multi, Id go make one. :P

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The biggest problem with this suggestion is that it requires a finite amount of available land, which means eventually new players will be unable to join the game.

The game already has a finite amount of land.

Or it used to...

Edited by Micheal Malone

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@Dabigbluewhale

No in fact what is not a valid response because i have no idea what it is you are confused about and unless i know what it is you are confused about i can not reply correctly.

I do not think you can make a game on land grabs alone and have it last longer then a year.

 

 

@Jester

What part seems complex to you the coding that might need to be done to make this idea work, or the game play?

As for coding well when considering the whole idea i can understand that this is a lot to ask.
As to the game play it would go something like this.

(list of actions by player)
The player hires settlers
The player picks out how much land to be claimed (Claimed land[4] open land[6])
(if player is worried about there land claim being usurped while they are away or they are usurping the claim of someone else then)
The player hires more settlers and deploy them to the land claim until it reaches colonial level.
(if the player is not worried about land claim challenges)
The player waits.

(The player does nothing else unless he/she wants to educate them self on the function of the game)

In situations of claim clash there would be a a few numbers showing what percentage of the population in the claim is the player's once the population density is reached the player holding a 51% or greater majority wins the claim.
((Example) using hypothetical 300 population density colonial level requirement, 10 sq km of land would require a total population of 3000 to reach the claim limit of 300 density and be upgraded to colonial status, 51% in this case would be 1530 so the player to first reach this level in only 10 land would win the claim once the total population reached 3000 or more assuming there is a claim challenge in progress)

But the important part here is the player would only have to make sure there population percentage is higher then the other person.
In situations where there are 3 or more players trying to claim the same land area it can be much harder to reach that 51% without sending lots of additional settlers and if you are unlucky enough to find at least 2 other claim challengers heaping on additional settlers like you are then it could turn into a resource race.
One land claim at a time is what i am thinking at the moment.

I am not sure i made this clear before but when a claim upgrades to colonial it is added to what ever colonial land count you already have you would not be continuously being adding additional colonial spots.

(Core land) 100
(Colonial land) 10
(Claim land) 10

In the above when the claim is finished it will not add another colonial land spot but rather add to the colonial land that is already there.

(Core land) 100
(Colonial land) 20
(Claim land) 0

so if you do not want to stack up to high on colonial land you may have to slow down the additional claims you make as the colonial land would have a population density to reach in order to be added to the core.


When dong a land claim challenge you will not be able to pick who's claim you challenge due to it being just a land claim and not officially apart of any nation yet.

Hoping i made things a bit clearer and did not babble on to much

 

 

@Fox

Not sure where you get the idea of multiple nations but maybe my overly lengthy explanation to jester might help you as well.

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@Dabigbluewhale

No in fact what is not a valid response because i have no idea what it is you are confused about and unless i know what it is you are confused about i can not reply correctly.

I do not think you can make a game on land grabs alone and have it last longer then a year.

I'm confused about the part where you think making land purchases to be overly complicated a good thing. Not that I have anything against complicated formulas, mind you. It's just this game is incomplete, we don't have trade or war (two important facets) coded, yet you want to developers to review the land system--which is already usable--and delay the game for another year.

And I didn't say to make a game on land grabs alone, I'm saying you might as well make a game from scratch with this idea. Hell, I might even play it.

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@Dabigbluewhale

 

The process the player would engage in does not seem all that complex to me.

hire settlers deploy them to selected land if you are worried about someone else scooping it up hire more settlers and deploy them until the land reaches colonial status.

 

It is because this game is incomplete that we suggest things, should i wait till everything is done before suggesting an idea that might be intresting but might force them to remodle a dozen things to make it fit or, offer the idea while still in developement so that if they like it enough to use it they can try and figure out how best to integrate it into the game before all of thous elements it would have to work with are in place, true that they might have to remodle a few things but not as many as if i had waited for the game to be done.

Fact is if they are doing this game correctly it will never be fully complete there will always be thing added here and there over the life of them game most of the time they will be little things so before the game is done is when to suggest the big ideas.

 

If i had the know how to make my own game i would but as i do not i am here and offering ideas if they do not like them they can say no and that will be that as it is not my game it is there game and they get final say on how it gets put together.

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Well, yeah. I guess I was wrong to suggest that you shouldn't be spitting out ideas during beta. But really, this idea is needlessly complicated and would require a complete overhaul of the functions we already have coded. My honest opinion is as Jester said: I don't believe it adds anything of value to the game.

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